I liked Terence Trent Darby but he never had the hype that Adam had, not even close and comparing him to Lambert is hilarious

ymmv, but i remember that he did… remember this as well… those who don’t learn from history are doomed to repeat it. let’s meet back in a year, and compare

Well, he’s kind of a superstar to me, lol. ‘ ¦ Love Terence Trent D’Arby. As Yet Unwritten just came up on my Ipod this morning, and, wow, I love Terence Trent D’Arby’ ¦

i loved his album ”the hardline according to terence trent d’arby” so much… the media and he conspired to fashion himself into the ”next prince”, the next ‘’superstar of superstars” after michael jackson… massive press and hype… giving him his props – dude was ferociously talented – he was, but after a short while, it became evident the media hype and d’arby’s own hubris and unchecked ego soured him on the music buying public and the industry – and he has never quite recovered from a career that began as a roaring thunderclap, and ended with a whimper… i still like his music, but his is still a very relevant and cautionary tale for those inclined to ”believe the hype”…

my fair share of artists receive much the same ‘’superstar, rockstar’  hype, and never live up to it ‘“ does terence trent d’arby ring any bells?

Well, he’s kind of a superstar to me, lol. … Love Terence Trent D’Arby. As Yet Unwritten just came up on my Ipod this morning, and, wow, I love Terence Trent D’Arby…

Otherwise, though, I think you make a good point!

So when has an Artist proven himself? When a single sells platinum, when an album sells gold, when they are asked to speak at a conference or have moderate financial success on a tour?

Everyone measures success differently’ ¦I look at success as the legacy you leave when the great one calls, other’s may look at success as even getting a recording contract and asking to perform in front of millions on a TV show.

your use of the word legacy is key for me – a body of work, over a period of time that helps lend credence to its designation upon an artist… ‘’success” is a highly relative/subjective term, and everyone’s standards for it will naturally vary… i may not have been around as long as some who have really followed pop and rock music, and studied its history, but i’ve studied it, and been around long enough to have seen my fair share of artists receive much the same ‘’superstar, rockstar” hype, and never live up to it – does terence trent d’arby ring any bells? i’m just saying that to foist the designation of such lofty terms as ‘’superstar”, ”rockstar” etc. onto any new artist entering the music business, before there are quantifiable standards to help measure and back up the claim is premature, at best… and for many, the cachet and real meaning behind the terms gets rendered almost irrelevant from its perpetual overuse …

So when has an Artist proven himself? When a single sells platinum, when an album sells gold, when they are asked to speak at a conference or have moderate financial success on a tour?

Everyone measures success differently…I look at success as the legacy you leave when the great one calls, other’s may look at success as even getting a recording contract and asking to perform in front of millions on a TV show.

I am not surprised that nice Christian housewives like this kind of thing, have you ever seen Christian Rock videos? Talk about out there and over the top!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ml7O8Tfc_PA

But Youtube can easily provide you the ‘auditable and verifiable body of work’  you require. I feel very secure in calling him fully seasoned, proven, and 100% dependable as a live performer.

using this same method of you tube verification as our model, taylor hicks also qualifies then, as pre and post idol he is given credit for being a seasoned, proven and dependable ”live” performer – but who with a straight face can honestly call him a ”rockstar”, lolol… as always, everyone’s mmv, but i’m old school when adding that label to any artist – the performance aspect, as well as the data generated via airplay, sales etc over a period of time has to be both factored into the equation… like the overused term ‘’superstar”, the term has begun to lose its cachet and power when the standards for rewarding it become so blurred and easy to attain… i’m not from missouri, but you have to show me you got the goods, over the long haul, before bestowing those terms….

To quote someone ‘nobody puts Glammy in a corner’ ¦’ 

K first of all I’m scared of the person you’re quoting. ‘Glammy?’  Adam isn’t a freakin hamster.

This is from way upthread, but the “Nobody puts Glammy in a corner…” is a cultural reference to Dirty Dancing: “Nobody puts Baby in a corner” and refers to society’s efforts to box someone in, trying to force them to conform. Therefore it’s a good fit for Adam because nobody, including the AI fans or the Out magazine editor, can expect him to conform to their rules.

The AI fans who didn’t go on the internet and see the pre Idol pictures and the videos may not like the post Idol Adam, but he is the same as he was pre Idol, just more famous. Many AI fans will move on, but if Adam played to that crowd alone he would wind up doing covers in Las Vegas sooner than later. This is his shot and he has to go for the brass ring. I don’t expect to like everything he does, but I think I will like most of it so I hope his gamble pays off.

has the performance via sales and airplay of ‘ tfm’ , ‘ fye’  and ‘ wwfm’ , all releases attributed to adam post idol, really been enough to foist this moniker on him? i would assume one would also need to have built up, over time like the examples you cited, an auditable and verifiable body of work to substantiate and validate this designation’ ¦

Via sales and airplay of ‘ tfm’ , ‘ fye’  and ‘ wwfm’ ?
Of course not.
But Youtube can easily provide you the “auditable and verifiable body of work” you require. I feel very secure in calling him fully seasoned, proven, and 100% dependable as a live performer.

i hope he doesnt lip sync at all.

A ‘Rockstar’  is a person in any field whose status as a proven performer is unqualified and dependable

has the performance via sales and airplay of ”tfm”, ”fye” and ”wwfm”, all releases attributed to adam post idol, really been enough to foist this moniker on him? i would assume one would also need to have built up, over time like the examples you cited, an auditable and verifiable body of work to substantiate and validate this designation… by that definition, adam still needs to put in the work and build up a body of some in the industry to give this credence, and a measure of credibility… jmo.

Good for Adam going out there and doing what he wants to do but I hope it doesn’t cost him some all important AI fans to buy the CD he put his heart and soul into.</

Both Adam and Kris need to build a bigger fanbase than just the American Idol fans. We have seen in their recent single sales that the AI fans cannot support them totally alone. They both need to attract fans from outside the AI bubble. Adam is trying to do that. If he loses a few AI fans along the way, so be it. Adam has been telling us all along what he wanted to do with his music. When I first heard the cd, I wasn’t surprised by it at all. As for the S&M, well it fits in with FYE. I doubt that you will see Adam doing S&M for songs like WYWM or any of the other ballads on his cd. IMO Adam will become very versatile about his performances.

jpfan
11/20/2009 at 9:26 am
Speaking of naked women/men on leashes being led around, bisexuality, whips, canes, S/M here’s Madonna’s video for Erotica

Thanks, jpfan. When FYE first came out and people were worrying about the potential content of the video, “Erotica” was one of the first ones that came to mind – and I stated as much here on the blog. One that seemed to push the limits further (at least to me as a teenager at the time) was Eurythmics “Missionary Man.” The imagery is certainly not new. And there will be people that are uncomfortable with it. And there will be many others that will find it titilating and exciting.

Adam can be all things to all people in terms of the interpretive styling of his vocals, BUT he can only physically be one thing at a time. At the AMAs he will be over-the-top, Zodiac Adam roaring out of the gate to show his stuff to those that haven’t experienced him before. On Wednesday at GMA (and thereafter), he will have more time to show other sides. But at the AMAs he’s out to brand himself, as I’ve speculated before. This is a big moment for him and he knows how he wants to play it. It will either work or not. But it will get everyone talking. That’s how Madonna started (and continued) her career.

It’s all happening!

Yes it IS all happening and it seems to be happening just as he hoped planned it. I am really stoked for Sunday and for everything else that follows. He may not steal the show from the more experienced, seasoned performers (with bigger budgets?), but I’m pretty certain his performance will be riveting. And that’s the key word – “performance”. Am I into S&M personally? No lol. But as part of Adam’s performance? Bring it on.

Btw – I love Cabaret and love the dark, 30’s, sexy atmosphere of Berlin that permeates the show. If Adam’s video has that feel I will love it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5LZRUZoVDc&translated=1

As you mentioned, we really aren’t talking about any disdain for women here,

Yes, it’s not like it’s “SMELL THE GLOVE” by Spinal Tap. Wish I could find a longer clip with more of Fran Dresher. Here is the gist of the cover from Wiki

In the mockumentary, the original cover featured “a greased, naked woman on all fours with a dog collar around her neck and a leash, and a man’s arm extended out…holding on to the leash and pushing a black glove in her face to sniff it.”

Which of course lead to the record company refusing the release the album.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xF5TeHf5QQ&feature=PlayList&p=5BFF245C9E835B38&index=20

Other videos have s/m imagery, leather gear, etc. Didn’t Madonna do a whole video full of those images 10 or 15 years ago? It’s not exactly new subject matter. It’s just new for a guy. I could see Britney Spears doing the exact same video/AMA performance. Of course what works for Britney, Madonna, Gaga won’t always work for Adam. That’s the issue here.

True. At this point neither we — nor Adam — have any idea what will actually work for Adam. (nor for Kris, Allison, Danny, etc., either, of course). It’ll be interesting to see what works and what doesn’t. Adam has a pretty big bag of tricks, however, and is very very thoughtful and savvy about show business. So I expect that — if he actually does have the goods to be a very popular artist — over time he’ll evolve something that will work for him.

I too have watched this show and been obsessed with it since the end of season 1. The only ‘old timers’  who don’t notice the HUGE difference between Clay, Taylor and Adam are the ones who have a different horse in the race.

Clay and Taylor had rabid, rabid fan bases. That was it. They did NOT have the media behind them like they do for Adam. In Taylor’s case he had weak material for his album and his management pretty much hung him out to dry.

Exactly.

A “Rockstar” is a person in any field whose status as a proven performer is unqualified and dependable, and who carries themselves (whether as a lawyer, writer, Indian Chief, or entertainer) with a style uniquely their own. Often eccentric and charismatic, they are first and foremost masters of their craft- all the rest is showmanship. Gerry Spence is a Rockstar Lawyer, Hunter Thompson was Rockstar Writer, Sitting Bull was a Rockstar Indian Chief.
Adam is a Rockstar Entertainer.

I’ve seen a couple of people mention he is performing second. Is that a fact or just a rumor?

Didn’t this rumor get started because he was named second in some press release that included a partial list of the performers? … I think somebody mentioned that being the second person named in a press release was a pretty big indication that he was considered a major draw …. and then that somehow morphed into the idea that he would *perform* second, over the course of the conversation. But nobody’s ever said he would perform second. As others have said, they’ll have to put this later in the evening.

But I think leashes and collars, if there are any in the video, or in other similar videos, are degrading and going too far.

Well, the thing is, this is a form of sexual imagery and play that turns a lot of people off. I realize that, and I’m sure Adam does as well.

However, it turns a very very very large number of people on. I have a feeling you’d be quite surprised at the very mainstream people, including nice Christian housewives in small midwestern towns, who like this kind of thing as a form of sexual/romantic *play.* And with Adam, it’s pretty clearly play — with roles, power exchanging, fantasy thrills, and such. It’s pretty clear to me that, in his mind, none of this has anything to do with actual violence or subordination of anybody’s will or misuse of power. And, really, it’s not all that different from the kind of vampire/werewolf imagery you see in something like the Twilight series and movies. The aura of power and darkness is really quite similar. And we all know how popular that is.

As you mentioned, we really aren’t talking about any disdain for women here, as you do see in some rap stuff. It’s too bad that some folks actually do feel very upset by this imagery, but I guess if one is among that group all you can really do is not watch it, and try to understand that for a lot of people some imagery of darkness and power is a really huge romantic turn-on and involves the thrill of role playing rather than actual subjugation.