The Bible teaches the Gay lifestyle is an abomination. Therefore, those who believe in the God of the Bible, follow it’s teachings.

Yet, I guarantee you that many who claim to follow the teaching of the Bible eat shellfish, and isn’t that supposed to be an abomination? I have to wonder how many people running around condemning gay people are also having shrimp for dinner. Things that make you go hmmmm….

Eventually she will grow into these songs and then who knows what will happen? I don’t see her as being as successful as Avril Lavigne though.

When I talk of looks, I am thinking of how Avril had her own fashion statement that became associated with Avril.

I did not have time to review all the videos with Kris on it, I did review some and from what I saw yes he did wear the wedding ring on the show, so that was a misstatement on my part, however, you are not 100% correct either in saying he wore the ring in every single picture – there’re 2 recent pictures taking by Allison and Danny on Top 4 (the one that shows Danny with a clean shaven look and without glasses) that shows he did not wear the ring on either hand.

So Kris wore the ring all the time during competition and some recent photos showing he did not wear the ring post competition, red flag? Actually I totally agree with you that this shouldn’t matter, my point as you might figure out is when this “should not matter” thing happened to Danny, then it became something hugely matter to some posters.

His wife, Katy, was NEVER hidden on the show. She was in the audience with the caption ‘Kris’ Wife’. She was in his intro package sitting on the couch with him, wearing the matching red aprons Aunt Gladys gave them as a wedding present. (Simon commented that he should have kept her hidden) She was sitting on the back of the car seat with him in the hometown parade. She spent the entire time he was on the show IN Los Angeles.

Kris didn’t hide the fact that he’s married or Katy EVER for votes.

With all that said, I have no big problem with Danny wearing a ring or not, or the fact that sometimes he does and sometimes he doesn’t.

Now when do we get the Kris Allen Billboard interview? Or did I miss it?

Also, just because Kris does not have as big of a voice as the others does not mean he does not have a great voice- for the most part, he was on pitch, great tone and phrasing,etc. In a TV Guide interview, the vocal coach for AI (her name is slipping my mind right now) she told Justin and Kim Caldwell praised Kris and called him a “quiet fire.” She was also describing Danny and talking about how he has to learn the subtleties of working a song instead of full on belting it through, but then she stopped herself and said that she thinks Danny just has not had time to process his wife’s death and everything is go go go. That’s part of the reason why I think Danny had a hard time on the show. Also, I don’t think not wearing a ring means anything.

kokko: If AI is all about manipulation and not about finding talents, then what does it say about Kris being the winner this year?

First: I didn’t say it’s all about manipulation and not about finding talents. I said it’s not about finding the best talent, and I said there is a lot of manipulation. I think the show strives first and foremost for “entertainment” that will get the most viewers. And I think it does that by trying to find a combination of talented singers and TV drama. I think they get the TV drama by selecting contestants with sob stories / heartwarming stories / whatever you want to call them, such as Danny, Scott, and single moms Lil and Alexis. I think they also select some more talented singers to throw into the pool in order to achieve some credibility that it’s really a talent show. Thus you have people like Kris, Adam, Allison, and Jesse Langseth.

And therefore, second: Kris being the winner this year (and Allison making it to 4th) says that talent won out over backstory.

As for Keith Urban and Lionel Richie saying Danny was their favorite, okay, fine. Maybe they like his style best, or maybe they had some other reasons. I said earlier in the thread that I don’t think he’s an awful singer and I even liked a bit of what he did. And given the pool of people who were selected for the top 13, I think he was probably worthy of finishing maybe 7th or so — not bad. But the gap between him and the three top-tier talents (Kradison) is painfully obvious to me. Doesn’t make him bad. Just makes him not as good as they are.

aek: Oh, Kokko, don’t you know that Simon is the HONEST judge, until he says something good about the idol that you don’t like. lol.

I don’t think he’s honest. I think he’s an idiot. I think he’s so narrow-minded that he can’t appreciate anything outside the Danny/Lil adult-contemporary realm. This is the guy who reacted to Adam’s Ring of Fire masterpiece by saying “What the hell was that?” (And no, I’m not really an Adam fan, despite recognizing his immense talent.) This is the guy who’s pushing Susan Boyle, for god’s sake! :biggrin_wp:

canuck: Incidentally, [Avril] honed her musical chops at church for those who think Danny’s music background counts for nothin.

Of course his background doesn’t count for nothin. A whole lot of the best singers ever have gotten their young experience singing in church.

Avril is the total package(looks, talent and she had a marketing concept too-skater chick). Incidentally, she honed her musical chops at church for those who think Danny’s music background counts for nothin.

However, I don’t think she is the next Avril Lavigne if she wants to be anti-Disney.

OK…this one went clear over my head. I don’t recall Avril ever being Disney or sold as a Disney type entertainer. She was playing with the big guys from the get go. Besides she was 18 when she recorded her first album which took a long time since she insisted on co-writing and did a damn good job of it.

If Allison has her type of career…Wow!

Now for Danny. I thought this was a good interview. He’s coming along with being a little less wordy.

They will also go for the drama in the beginning to keep the interest of the show high. Did you really think Tatty would move on? We always have a few drama queens and kings who don’t deserve to be there….Sanjaya anyone? Name any year and there will be a person on the tour that made it for the drama or the cuteness and not for talent. A good mixture of the dramatic, the cute, the popular and those who actually have talent. Bottom line: It is show biz. It throws people into the machine just to watch them squirm. Only the strong survive.

Of course Simon could be wrong, he may be wrong sometimes when judging a particular performance, but he was seldom wrong as far as I remember on evaluating someone’s overall talents and potentials.

edit: again with the sarcasm directed at other posters…

There’s no question in my mind that the judges thought Danny could sing, and sing well. Simon didn’t mind criticizing Danny, but he would always say he could really sing. In fact, all of the judges thought Danny could sing well.

I’ve been watching this show a long time. Yes, they do “pimp” certain people, BUT when those people start showing that they don’t have the goods, they turn on them on a dime. I remember them pimping Kellie Pickler, but then as she started to screw up, they stopped with the compliments. Look what happened to Lil. It became very obvious that they wanted her gone.

I think the AI judges totally overpimped Danny and he did gain fans, but I don’t think he sings as well as Allison, Adam or Kris. He also doesn’t have the music knowledge or originality of Allison, Adam or Kris. Reality tv likes a good sob story and Danny had that and they went with it.

I know what I like and dislike and people really aren’t going to change my opinion. Danny does have fans and they should support him. It will be interesting to see if he can make it in the music industry. I’m inclined to think he won’t.

I don’t know what all the wedding ring thing is about, so without even knowing whether that was a wedding ring, the fact that he did not put on a ring or put back on again means he did not really love his wife as much as he claimed he did? Kris is married I don’t think he wore the wedding ring on the show. His wife has been kept a very low profile during the competition but no one seemed to criticize that as a tactic to gain female votes.

I understand Danny’s voice or singing may not appeal to everyone, but he does have the vocal talents, and he does stand out from the crowd. I remember that evening when he was eliminated, during the post show hours when contestants were interacting with fans and the media, Simon came to Danny with Paula standing next to him telling Danny he’s one of the best singers they had on the show, given Simon’s character and the fact that Danny was already eliminated, he did not have to say this if he was not genuinely feeling that way. Of course Simon could be wrong, he may be wrong sometimes when judging a particular performance, but he was seldom wrong as far as I remember on evaluating someone’s overall talents and potentials.

I also remember there was a short interview with Keith Urban (before it was announced he would have a duet with Kris) on who his favorite idol contestant was, and he answered Danny. In another interview, Lionel Richie was asked by Barbara Walters who should win this year’s AI competition, and Lionel said Danny should’ve won. We are talking seasoned musicians here, I can go on with the list but it does not matter the competition is over and as Danny says AI is a launching pad I hope he will get signed cos there are fans out there who want to listen to his original music and really don’t care all the personal character/religious/political bullshits that have been going on in the blogosphere.

Also, I want to apologize if I offended or got off track last night. It was late and I was very tired. I thought about my posts after I laid down to sleep, but I knew it was too late to edit.

But he is a heck of a lot better singer than Kris imo’ ¦.and even many Danny detractors will say that.

Seriously? You’ve actually seen Danny detractors say that? I find that astonishing. As I said upthread, I don’t think Danny belongs on the same stage with Kris/Adam/Allison ‘” especially Adison, but Kris too.

Yep. And I’ve seen it a good bit. There are many, many, people who don’t think Kris is a good singer. Most people like Kris, but many don’t think he belonged in the top as a singer. I don’t even think that Kris thinks he is that GREAT of a singer.

I’m just getting around to editing this thread. I deleted some comments and edited others.

Those of you who show up here only to defend danny might want to refresh yourselves on the guidelines. You also might check back on your posts to see the edits that I made.

When I have to keep editing a poster over and over again for the same things, I eventually put that poster in moderation.

1. Please DO NOT comment on the tone of the thread (i.e. “I’m sick of the negativity” or “ad nauseum” I deleted both those posts)

2. Don’t bait or generalize about “rival” fan groups when defending YOUR favorite Idol.

3. NO LECTURING OR FINGER WAGGING. I just banned a poster for that very thing.

4. If criticism of your favorite Idol makes you sensitive, it might be best if you head back to your fan forum.

The Interview

Danny says: AI is the easiest way to launch a music career.

At about 1:10, he pats himself on the back!

‘Come Rain or Come Shine’  – Allison asked for the song! The bastard made her draw for it! In a genre biased toward the men with an even more biased slate of songs, Danny wasn’t MAN enough to yield to a girl, a girl who was kind enough to yield her pick to a full grown man earlier in the competition! Disgusting. However, Alli proved once again that she is the pro and knocked it outta the park once again. Just another example of why she has a deal and Danny has none. Oh, Danny’s performance was the only one that I thought distinguished him, in a positive sense, throughout the competition.

‘Scream On’ : some people are deluded, seriously deluded, with Danny at the top of the list. Ripped a cord? That’s fresh, inventive. Ripped a contract? Before his own eyes.

The man is a mediocre singer. That fact, in and of itself, doesn’t mean he can’t get a deal. Kristen has some thoughts on that recently posted elsewhere in the blog.

There were various times throughout the competition where some of the contestants wanted the same songs and they had pick them out of a hat to settle things.

Both Anoop and Allison wanted “Beat It”, but Allison gave it to Anoop. Is Anoop also wrong for not yielding to her and not “Man” enough and giving the song to her?

And Scott said he lost in the hat pick many times. Should some of the other contestants have been man and woman enough and let him have his first song choice, at least one of the times he lost out?

I think that a lot of them probably wanted to sing the same songs, but they found a way to deal work things out amongst themselves.

And I wish that they had more songs to choose from. I get the feeling that a lot of times, especially during really specific themes, they have a limited list of songs to choose from and that’s why some of them kept wanting the same songs, and why some of them kept losing out on their first song choice.

I don’t know Danny in person but I really appreciate aek and a couple other posters here in making an effort to provide another perspective or viewpoint when discussing Danny amidst all the negativity. We are definitely the minority in this blog.

:wink1_tb:

I think that Danny fans are a minority on a lot of the non fan sites on the Internet. But I believe that he has a lot of fans in general. Sans Twittergate, and a few haters who will bash him sometimes, he gets a lot of Love on Twitter. When he updates he gets flooded with a lot of Twitter messages of love, and support. So I am happy that he does have t fans that care about him, that support him that will keep on supporting him.

Danny may have the last laugh. Heh.

I think so too. I think that he might have many laughs. One will come when he announces his record deal. I think that he has either signed one already or will sign one with a record company after tour.

I don’t think that’s likely. Kris always had the votes. Too many people think praise from the judges, or even the media, has to do with how many votes somebody is getting, and actually these things are meaningless. Literally. All that matters is the votes.
It was obvious to many people that the show was not as gung-ho for Kris and for Adam or Danny, but that doesn’t mean the viewers weren’t. How could he ever even get to the Top 3 if he didn’t have a strong fanbase of voters? How could he avoid being in the bottom three (he was only there once) without a huge amount of votes all along?

I think that Kris has a pretty big fanbase. I think that him, Danny and Adam all have pretty big fanbases. But I think that the casual voters made the difference in who won Idol this year. I do think that Adam/Danny/Kris were all close in the voting top 3 night, but that Kris’s version of “Heartless” plus the obscure song that Danny sung, got Kris enough casual votes to help secure him a place in the finale.

And I think that the casual voters helped him win, partly because of his performance of “Heartless” the week before, but I also because I think they believed that he sung “No Boundaries” better than Adam did. I think that Adam has a better voice than Kris does, but I think that “No Boundaries” fit Kris’s voice better.

Kris has a big fanbase, but I believed that the casual voters really help put him over the top and give him the win over Adam.

He was indeed consistent ‘” consistently mediocre. He was consistently out of tune ‘” not catastrophically so most of the time (which is why a lot of people think he wasn’t out of tune), but disturbingly often. He had a lot of breath control problems. He rarely displayed any variation in his delivery. In sum, he wasn’t a disaster most of the time (though all of Scream On was, not just the end), and he had a few moments that even I liked, but IMO he (like almost all of the lower-finishing contestants) doesn’t even belong on the same stage with Kris/Adam/Allison ‘” just doesn’t have their level of talent. Not a knock against him personality-wise at all, just talent-wise. And if you decide to go on the show, excuses like not being familiar with the style of music (WTF?) and not having a dress rehearsal just don’t cut it.

I think that he was consistantly decent and far more consistant than some of the other contestants.

kokko: If Danny were really that bad as some posters point out I just don’t understand why he was considered as front runner and praised by all 4 judges (I know this had made a lot of posters here mad) especially Simon who had no reason to praise someone whom he thought was a mediocare singer.

lucy: So why would lacking all that stuff ‘” at age 29 ‘” make him a frontrunner?

Because AI is not about finding the best talent — it’s about creating a reality show that lots of people want to watch. I’ve seen mj remind us all that when they select the contestants, they are “casting” the show, not selecting the best musical talent. This is why, for example, someone like Megan was selected in the wildcard round over a far superior talent such as Jesse Langseth.

Someone here — I think it was Kirsten — asserted that the producers never intended to have Danny win — rather, they intended him to be the “foil” for Adam, sort of the anti-Adam, who would eventually be sacrificed for Adam’s win. I don’t know if that theory is correct, but I think it fits right in with the manipulative games that the producers play, in contradiction to the notion that this is purely a talent show.

All of this is why, having now watched my first full season of AI, I consider myself an Allison fan and not an AI fan. A year and a half ago, I barely knew what AI was. This year, I invested enormous amounts of time and nerves in the show because I was so totally blown away by Allison’s singing, unlike any singer I’ve heard in my half-century on this planet. But I think the show overall is, in a lot of ways, despicably manipulative and fairly awash in mediocre-to-poor talent.

Returning to Danny, I think it might be worth pointing out that I haven’t said he’s a horrible singer, just mediocre, which means ordinary, barely passable, etc. — not awful (though Scream On went from awful to truly horrifying).

kokko: If he were that mediocare I also don’t understand why he could have a fanbase comparable to that of Adam and Kris and had never been in bottom 3 until the week he was eliminated. I don’t want to go into the technical aspects of singing but a lot of people on youtube, AI Board & various blogs says they feel connected to his singing and many are moved by some of the songs he sang on AI.

I think you just answered your own question. A lot of people connect to a performer for reasons other than outstanding musical talent. And this ties back to what I was just saying above about the show not being purely a talent show.

The way I look at Danny situation is, if his knowledge in secular music is really limited and that gave him a hard time in choosing songs etc, we should be happy for him for being able to go as far as as Top 3 instead of ridiculing him for even trying out for AI.

I’m not ridiculing him for trying out. Anyone who wants to pursue their dream of making it on AI, go for it. I just want the contestants to have a realistic view of what they’re doing. If someone tries out for something that they’re not as well-prepared for as others are, then accept that discrepancy and don’t use it as an excuse.

lucy: So why did a white soul/R&B/gospel guy suddenly get frontrunner status, even to the point of having the *one* song written for the finale be clearly written particularly for him?

Why do you say it was written particularly for him? It was just another sappy, crappy, generic inspirational coronation song.

aek: But he is a heck of a lot better singer than Kris imo’ ¦.and even many Danny detractors will say that.

Seriously? You’ve actually seen Danny detractors say that? I find that astonishing. As I said upthread, I don’t think Danny belongs on the same stage with Kris/Adam/Allison — especially Adison, but Kris too.

oceana: [Allison's] not a talent-show-veteran like this season’s Jasmin, or Kim Caldwell or Diana D. were.

I figured you were probably being metaphorical here, and I see by your subsequent post that you were, in light of her previous experience on the Telemundo show. And I certainly agree:

Everything about her is real and raw. She almost explodes with talent and personality.

And in a thread about Danny and Allison, I can’t believe that I, a totally off-the-deep-end Allison fan, have been talking about Danny!

loosegoose: He lost his wedding ring two years ago’“while his wife was very much alive’“and he didn’t replace it? Huge red flag there.

It might be in his case — don’t know. But in general, no. My wife hasn’t worn hers in many years because it’s been too small. I had to stop wearing mine a year ago for the same reason — I didn’t gain weight or anything, so I don’t know what it is — something about getting old and spreading out maybe? My inability to get my ring on my finger makes me mad, and I periodically try it again to see if I can. But it’s not a big enough deal to get us to spend the money on getting our rings enlarged — we’d rather spend our money on other things (like the AI concert…. gah!). As you said, a wedding ring is indeed a potent symbol of the relationship, but it’s only a symbol. I’ve been married to my wife for 19 years next Tuesday, and I still love her and will until the day I die. Symbols or a lack of them don’t change that.

However, I tend to agree with you that Danny’s probably not likely to have that same kind of view.

I made it through 2 minutes of Danny’s interview before boredom set in and I had to switch it off….mostly because he says the same things in exactly the same way in pretty much every interview. Obviously, to me, Danny is very much a creature of habit. Since he doesn’t seem overly quick witted it is much easier for him to always rely on the tried and true. That is how he functions and, in my opinion, that is how he sings. As has been alluded to before, Danny has a beautiful (though untrained) voice but that is as far as his talent really goes. Personally, I think Danny is a great choir type singer…give him the notes and the words and he does wonderfully.

Danny’s challenge, vocally, is that he hasn’t learned or cared to take that voice beyond singing notes and lyrics. And, I don’t think, it is that easy to learn the nuances of being a true, great, recording artist at 29 when someone just doesn’t have that innate music sense. That’s why I’ll never buy into Danny as the next great recording star because I don’t think he will ever be able to “sing on the fly”, or “sing off the cuff”, or harmonize in an impromptu duet, or read some sheet music and make the song “his” without hours of work with uber guidance along the way.

Allison, on the other hand, is very smart both innately and vocally. She understands, without being told, how to make a song her own. She knows who she is as a person and as a performer (no Disney, smart girl) and can manipulate her voice to suit the situation. She is sweet and demure during one song, bombastic and wholly powerful in the next. She may say she is “shy” but her mannerisms and her ease with people make that more a newly 17 insecurity rather than a “truism”. All the things that Danny lacks she has in spades. She will do well and she will be around a long time just because she knows who she is and where she wants to be.

Actually, Allison won a talent show on Telemundo.

Kim Caldwell and Diana D. were in beauty shows as children (a lot of them, was my impression), and had that fake veneer that kids get who grow up being in those competitions. Allison might have been in a competition based on talent, but she doesn’t have a false veneer, she seems very real, that’s what I meant.

OK, wedding rings are no big deal to folks here. But I doubt if Danny is just a free spirit who’s not bound by convention.

I wouldn’t generalize about how “folks here” feel about wedding rings because many of them probably think they are a big deal, but not everyone attaches the same significance to them.

Good point about Danny not not being bound by convention. He doesn’t seem like a free spirit does he? I don’t know much about him though and can’t say. Maybe he got busy and forgot to replace the ring. It is an interesting discussion because symbols are always intriguing.

Actually, Allison won a talent show on Telemundo. She passed on the recording contract prize though, because she wanted to try out for AI. It turned out to be a smart move on her part.

A wedding ring is such a potent symbol of the whole relationship. Who in their right mind loses one and doesn’t bother to replace it? Either he’s not in his right mind, or’ ¦(I’ll let somebody else connect the dots.)

Symbols mean different things to different people, and one doesn’t have to be out of their mind to not attach so much importance to a piece of jewelry.

A wedding ring is such a potent symbol of the whole relationship. Who in their right mind loses one and doesn’t bother to replace it? Either he’s not in his right mind, or’ ¦(I’ll let somebody else connect the dots.)

LOL. I guess I’m not in my right mind either. I’m sure there are lots of people who would agree. Hee!

When I was pregnant, my fingers swelled and I had to take off the ring. Now, it doesn’t seem to fit right and is uncomfortable, so I just don’t wear it. I suppose I should get it re-fitted, but I’ve just never gotten around to it. I don’t buy into a lot of society’s conventions. If people I meet want to think me insane and judge me for it, why let them. I think they are being intrusive and nosey-parkers.

I remember when one of our neighbours was moving in, he jumped off the back of the truck and his wedding ring caught on something and ripped his finger right off. My Mom saw him staggering around the front lawn and rushed him to the hospital. Then she came back and she and my Dad had to scout around to find the damn finger before his 4 year old son found it (the momentum of the accident caused it to fly off into the lawn and the grass was a little tall because the former owner had moved out a week before). They never did find the ring. I’m not sure he replaced it (they couldn’t re-attach the finger. The tear wasn’t clean and my parents took too long to find it. Shiver). I know that a lot of people who work in heavy industries take off their wedding rings because these kinds of industrial accidents are VERY common. In fact, it’s against the regulations for many of them to wear any kind of jewelry while working. So, it is easy for them to lose their wedding rings or stop wearing them.

Personally, I’m not going to judge Danny or his commitment to his wife by this.

ETA:

None of those cases apply to Danny. He’d worn his ring for years so apparently it didn’t conflict with his lifestyle or pose a danger at work.

We don’t know that. I’m pretty sure that most truck drivers do simple maintenance on their trucks (it would be daft not do some) and it would be wise to take off your rings when you do some of that work (or some of the work with trucks in general. Like my neighbour who lost his finger jumping off a truck). Or maybe when he was doing work around the house (electricians I know don’t wear their rings when working and I’m sure there is a reason for that). He may have taken his ring off several times and successfully kept track of it to put it back on his finger, but one time he did not.

Some men choose not to wear wedding rings at all because their lifestyle really doesn’t work well with one. Sometimes they’re the type who would lose it or they work at jobs where they can’t wear one or where it would be dangerous to do so. One of my science teachers never wore rings because he lost a finger when his ring got caught on something once.

None of those cases apply to Danny. He’d worn his ring for years so apparently it didn’t conflict with his lifestyle or pose a danger at work. And he has all his fingers.

If it didn’t bother Danny’s wife, it doesn’t bother me.

And we know that, how?

He lost his wedding ring two years ago’“while his wife was very much alive’“and he didn’t replace it? Huge red flag there.

I don’t necessarily think that’s a huge red flag. Some men choose not to wear wedding rings at all because their lifestyle really doesn’t work well with one. Sometimes they’re the type who would lose it or they work at jobs where they can’t wear one or where it would be dangerous to do so. One of my science teachers never wore rings because he lost a finger when his ring got caught on something once.

*shrug* If it didn’t bother Danny’s wife, it doesn’t bother me.