There are a lot to struggling artists out there just needing exposure. I remember Carly Smithson, everyone was bashing her at the beginning as being a “professional” having had a contract with some record company, yada, yada. she was dubbed a “plant.” I think there were a couple of others people attacked also as being “professionals” or having put out singles, indies, etc. Carly sold like 1,000 albums and that’s it and her contract expired before she auditioned. Sure these people just don’t wake up one morning and decide they are going to audition for A.I. They’ve been working on their craft and all are struggling artists and broke.

What is A.I. going to do with Adam, he’s put them in a terrible position.

Being openly gay does, in fact, often make it more difficult for artists to sell in the US. The Scissor Sisters are enormous stars in Europe–not here. Mika is a huge international star, but there are tons of people here who have no idea who he is. It’s not a hard and fast rule, and there are probably major labels willing to sign openly gay people, but if you take the general difficulty of getting signed at all, no matter how talented you are, and add this on top of that, it’s difficult.

We could take each of those kids and point out some area that did not meet some “Middle America” criteria. This “middle America” label is pretty condescending to alot of people out there. The word “christain ” has been flung around on here with such vehemence, bordering on hate. No matter what side of the fence, it still sounds and feels the same.

What about the unwed mother?
What about the Puerto Rican kid?
What about the Indian kid from NC?
What about the young African-American woman with three small kids?
What about the divorced mother with a small child?
What about the bi-racial kid?
What about the sight-impaired kid?
What about the conservative christian guy?

In the long run, the contest came down to the two talented pretty boys. There were alot of factors that got them there. For me it was talent, personality, joy of music, kindness and class showed toward everyone…all those tangibles and intangibles.

My world is no different than your world, I just try not to raise up one while putting down another. Kris said it quite succinctly, “Why can’t everyone just get along?”

And as far as the numbers, I did make an assumption, which could not be proven with the data I had available. I apologize.

To bring this back on topic, Wilshire didn’t jump on the Adam bandwagon, now they have — it’s business.

Oh, yeah, and the media did play a huge role in this no matter how you look at it.

YMMV

Because of this I believe these totals are close to an accurate assessment of singles sold during and post Idol.

The figures are reliable for post-idol sales. You may believe my assumption is flawed concerning the complete the album, that’s your perogative. But the post-idol figures are accurate based on numbers available, whether it is to your liking or not.

In your original statement, you were making claims about sales during and post Idol. Since to me your basic premise is flawed (Rickey is a nice guy, but he runs an AI blog and doesn’t have any more access to in-season sales numbers than anyone else), projecting from post sales numbers and making conclusions about overall season totals is inherently unreliable in my view. As for whether your post Idol numbers have been calculated corrected, I have no idea. And, truthfully, I don’t care because I’ve moved on and am more excited about what both these guys, Adam and Kris – and Allison too – will do in November.

As far as your other posts go, the sense I get is that you don’t believe homophobia really exists in this country or, to the extent that it does, it’s been artificially manufactured by the media. That’s cool. To each his own, mileage varying and all that. I don’t want to get into a dog-chasing-tail kind of argument. I kinda wish I lived in your world though.

As far as Wilshire was concerned, there was more to it than Adam being openly gay and not wanting to invest money in him. The record industry has promoted and stood behind far more “outrageous” people, than a nice, well-mannered glam-goth kid who happens to be gay. JMO

‘The new release from the talented 2009 American Idol runner-up!’ 

http://www.allaccess.com/

IMO Adam’s early works album won’t affect his RCA album sales. If anything fans will have the opportunity to purchase both albums. And you never know, Adam’s pre-idol album might be better than his RCA album. With the exception of “Want” which is a badly written song with a with a repetitive chorus, there might be some good music on Adam’s summer release album. Personally I am going to listen to snippets from both albums and purchase the songs I like the best.

And if Adam Lambert does have a contract with another label, it would be in 19E’s best interest not to manage him after the tour. 19E 19M does not need this headache and all the accusations that will follow when this blows up in the press. The management of American Idol is indeed in a very precarious position if Adam has a contract with another record company. If Adam has been honest then there won’t be a problem. But if Adam lied or forgot about this alleged contract, then I see no reason for 19E to extend their relationship with someone that was not truthful, because it will hurt their reputation.

Also, Adam already has a recording contract with RCA and I’m sure RCA and another management firm will be able to manage him properly.

Rickey from Rickey.org stated that Adam fans are “completists” when he saw Adam’s album sales were higher than Kris’s, but the single sales were lower. I ‘ve read many negative reactions concerning both Kris and Adam’s sales as not being all that impressive, especially when compared to David Cook. I think they’re both doing well.

The album compilation was a complete the album deal, meaning any singles that had been purchased during Idol would not be repurchased when buying the Album compilation. In other words when buying the Album compilation, you pay for only the singles you did not have already. Because of this I believe these totals are close to an accurate assessment of singles sold during and post Idol.

So you’re assuming that everyone who bought singles also bought albums? Sorry, I think that’s a flawed assumption and therefore your figures are not reliable. I agree with anna in vegas, though, I would love to see the true numbers.

As of week ending 6/21/09, Kris has sold singles/albums — $1,058,279.70
As of week ending 6/21/09, Adam has sold singles/albums — $901,641.00

The album compilation was a complete the album deal, meaning any singles that had been purchased during Idol would not be repurchased when buying the Album compilation. In other words when buying the Album compilation, you pay for only the singles you did not have already. Because of this I believe these totals are close to an accurate assessment of singles sold during and post Idol. These figures do not reflect Ringtones (Kris was #1 for several days), videos (Adam did well here, Kris also made a strong showing), I-tune pass and singles/albums that fell off the Top 200 digital chart.

Of course, not engraved in stone.

The American public will vote with it’s pocket book come November and not one person on this board can predict what will happen with Kris or Adam’s albums. We can look at how they have done so far after Idol and say they have done okay and that is all not fantastic or earth shattering or record breaking. Just Okay. That is all we have to go on for now.

Please enlighten us on exactly what they have done since Idol (?). Unless I am reading this incorrectly, they haven’t had a chance to do anything yet since Idol except some interviews and rehearsing for the tour.

I would also like to agree with the person who previously stated about Daughtry, AI votes do not determine album sales.

BTW: I would still love to see the iTunes sales figures for AI8. What’s the big deal about not revealing them? :ponder_tb:

Adam mentioned he was a little frustrated doing “the Ten Commandments” because the director and producer spoke to him about “Is Anybody Listening?” sounding too gay and to tone it down.

So, yeah. It hasn’t been an easy road for Adam.

There are about a billion reasons why somebody with genius-level talent may not *ever* get à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“discoveredà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  in an industry like music. Even if that person does have the potential to be a à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“global superstar.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ 

Great post, lucy. Very thorough and insightful and I agree with everything you wrote.

And you make an important point. Adam wasn’t just a gay artist; he was an openly gay artist with no intention of ever going back in the closet. While a lot of the reasons you cite represent hurdles, I would argue that the issue of his gayness was one of the higher hurdles Adam faced. The whole “why didn’t Adam make it big before” question just seems to tacitly ignore that point. Like it never mattered. But it did. Emphasis on the past tense.

Bottom line: I think Adam would be the first to admit that he came on this show with something to prove. Something to prove to the agents and the record companies and the producers who were unwilling to take a chance on him because of his sexual orientation. He bypassed them all and went directly to the people and put his outsized talent out there for the world to see and fearlessly “put on a show.” Some of my favorite Idol moments were watching Simon’s reaction to the fans’ reactions to an Adam performance. That slow Cheshire cat grin would start spreading over his face and you just knew he was getting it.

Although he didn’t win, Adam was HUGELY successful on this basically (no matter how hard it tries not to be) cheesy show pitched squarely to small town Middle America. As Adam has said, you don’t get a record deal unless you have a fanbase. Adam proved he has a fanbase, because he had to … because those agents, producers and record companies thought his being openly gay might get in the way of acquiring a fanbase. Wrong.

Now (hopefully) the gay issue is on a back burner. It may never go away completely, but at least it’s manageable, on a low simmer. And the fact that it is no longer a controlling issue is exciting and one of the reasons I’m so hopeful about Adam’s future prospects. Because in so many other areas Adam is strong and evolved: his beautifully trained voice, his performance instincts and polish, his confidence, his musical knowledge, his business savvy. Now that this sexual orientation/fanbase hurdle (which never should have been a hurdle in the first place) has been removed, Adam is in a flat out sprint. Yeah, I’m liking his chances a lot.

I live in Connecticut, so Proposition 8, is California’s deal. It appears California is more conservative than the worldview realizes. I’m not here to debate politics. In the theatrical world, in the art/literary world, in the show business world in general, I’m certain being gay is not a foreign concept. Nor is it a foreign concept in a household in Texas or Montana or North Carolina or Maine.

I do not believe Adam being gay held him back in the industry. That just doesn’t fly for me at all. Adam lived openly as a gay man as I live openly as a heterosexual woman. I don’t mention my sexuality ever second of every waking moment. No one cares. We all live our lives, struggling to make our mortgages, car payments, rent, seeking employment, finding love, dying…

The media decided to run with the gay thing. The media chose to judge most Americans as being homophobic. The media tried to force feed us this crap over and over again. It appears many of Adam’s fans swallowed it. America, in fact, chose Adam Lambert over Danny Gokey, basing it on, I would hope, talent and not that Danny was a conservative Christian. Or are we all prejudice in our own unique way?

Adam is a young man, hoping to have a long music career. Was exploiting his sexuality his decision or a decision that the media and producers made for him? Not one person that I know mentioned Adam was gay. It was always about the music and personal taste.

On another front, all I can say is whoa, Mayfair, just, I don’t even know. I’m always amazed by generalizations that fly so freely. Not to get all patriotic, but I think we do damn well here in America, melding a variety of cultures, religions, and political viewpoints.

We could have a thousand testimonials from people all over the world, stating Adam is the greatest. Kris’s fans worldwide would attest the same about him. He does have them, as well.

I balk at fanaticism, find it disturbing on all levels. The mindset freaks me out — so much bad comes from it.

Bottom line is: all we can do is wait and see about Wilshire, Hi-Fi, as well as, Adam Lambert’s future success. I hope he can rise above it all.

In terms of INXS, though, the grassy knoll is a few football fields long, a lot of fans are not satisfied they are getting the total story from any side right now and the sadder thing is JD is writing some great stuff which he is sharing with fans online. Despite his flaws, that boy is like a cat and I think he has some lives yet.

These shows do show that there is a great deal of undiscovered brilliant talent out there and Idol and Rockstar doesn’t even scratch the surface.

Ty Taylor is a great stage presence, sexy, edgy with a killer voice. But even exposure on Rockstar INXS hasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t really changed his career – people loved Ty but he couldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t shake that musical theatre thang which wouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t work for that particular band. They needed a more organic lead singer. Ty was already doing headline roles in musical theatre before the show, he continues to do the same – I am not sure if he wanted a solo career or not or whether he has pursued it. I got a chance to see him perform solo in a special gig for some of the Rockstar INXS contestants in Toronto and he was incredible – he even performed an original song he had written and we thought it was dynamite – Ty surprised us with that one.

However Rockstar only got a small fraction of the viewership of American Idol so it is not surprising that many of the extremely talented people that performed on both shows, INXS and Supernova are still struggling. Probably Suzie McNeil from Season 1, perhaps Marty Casey is a very close 2nd, and Ryan Star from Season 2 have come the farthest and they still got a long way to go. And again Suzie, Marty and Ryan would blow most AI contestants off the stage.

Amen about how all these mega-talented, uber-hardworking people from Rockstar are great evidence that you can have the right stuff and do the right stuff and still not fully “make it.”

And when you think of JD, who got the INXS gig, – I agree that they wanted the “organic” thing that he has (and I do think he’s really talented). But I would bet the band also resonated with some of his out-of-control, neurotic, needy stuff cause it reminded them a bit of their beloved Hutchence….So there are all these intangibles involved, too, that people making the choices that lead you to stardom may not even be aware of.

My question is how did this global superstar not get recognized until American Idol?

My impression of AI voters is that they don’t want a true star. Like everything in today’s celebrity culture, they want someone to whom they can relate. Someone that embodies their view of themselves. Someone they can take home to dinner, have a bear with or even date. Obama had to go boiling and drink bear to prove to people that he wasn’t better than them so that he could get elected. Clinton was reduced to downing shot of whiskey for god’s sake.

When it comes to the American populace voting, what I see as foreigner, is that they vote for the familiar rather than the stellar.

I’m not saying that Adam will be a global star, no one can know that in today’s fluxing music market.
What I am saying is that the logic of gaging future global, or local, success based on the response of the AI voting public has been proven flawed for many years now.

Ty Taylor is a great stage presence, sexy, edgy with a killer voice. But even exposure on Rockstar INXS hasn’t really changed his career – people loved Ty but he couldn’t shake that musical theatre thang which wouldn’t work for that particular band. They needed a more organic lead singer. Ty was already doing headline roles in musical theatre before the show, he continues to do the same – I am not sure if he wanted a solo career or not or whether he has pursued it. I got a chance to see him perform solo in a special gig for some of the Rockstar INXS contestants in Toronto and he was incredible – he even performed an original song he had written and we thought it was dynamite – Ty surprised us with that one.

However Rockstar only got a small fraction of the viewership of American Idol so it is not surprising that many of the extremely talented people that performed on both shows, INXS and Supernova are still struggling. Probably Suzie McNeil from Season 1, perhaps Marty Casey is a very close 2nd, and Ryan Star from Season 2 have come the farthest and they still got a long way to go. And again Suzie, Marty and Ryan would blow most AI contestants off the stage.

I think that all the stuff about à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“global superstarà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  boils down to is à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’  A lot of people think that Adam is mad talented and very charismatic. But being those things doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even guarantee that he would ever have been discovered, let alone guarantee any particular kind of future.

This. Adam is, in many eyes, amazingly and unusually gifted, but even now it’s not guaranteed that he’ll be a global star. I’m just really glad that he’s been discovered and is making an album.

Interesting to hear from perspectives in Denmark, btw.

My question is how did this global superstar not get recognized until American Idol? Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m serious here. Every show he auditioned for, every song he sang should have been pure gold.

Well, the thing is “global superstar” is a combination of things — talent, but also marketing, having just the right company behind you that is able to push you forward in just the right way, hitting the “right moment,” having the exact right songs written by and for you and produced in the exact right way to hit the moment, having the right look, having producers that give you aural and visual stuff that strikes just the right chord with a lot of audiences, etc. So I think it’s quite possible that a “global superstar” could go by a lot of people without being “noticed” — because even if you notice an extreme talent, you have no way of knowing whether all of these other things will come together.

Plus, plenty of people with brilliant talents never become big stars at all. When you’re trying to work your way up, you only have a certain selection of jobs — and the job of “superstar” isn’t one of them. There are jobs in bands, in musical theater, in little cabarets in your town. Your brilliant talent — even if it is absolutely genius quality — may not be exactly the right fit for any of those roles or venues, or others may be jealous of you and try to shove you aside, or your inexperience may make you unable to showcase your brilliance properly, or you may be too adventurous to be fully recognized by most people, or the local critic or record producer may be sick of that particular venue or genre and not show up to a performance to see you.

And then you can put out your own demos — but they will virtually never be brilliantly produced and they may have to fall into line behind the not-as-brilliant but good demo that was sent to the label by the company president’s brother-in-law’s nephew. And maybe your genre isn’t the “hot” one right at the moment that it arrives at the record label, and perhaps they aren’t able to recognize that your style could, in fact, be the next one to take the world by storm, because everybody, even normally very talented trendspotters, has blind spots. Or maybe you come onto the radar screen but people decline to take a chance on you because they think maybe you don’t have the right look or they decide that the world may not be ready to fully embrace an out gay performer who has pictures around of himself in drag or because they figure that you’re a little too short, or chubby, or too white or too black, or too old….

There are about a billion reasons why somebody with genius-level talent may not *ever* get “discovered” in an industry like music. Even if that person does have the potential to be a “global superstar.” And for those who get discovered, the combination of factors that could actually make that person the “global superstar” are so numerous, and so many are completely 100 percent out of the person’s control and even out of their corporate sponsor’s control (or ability to predict) that saying someone doesn’t have the *talent* to become a global superstar just because they haven’t become one doesn’t make any sense.

Why didn’t anybody publish Emily Dickinson’s poetry? Why didn’t Herman Melville sell more than a handful of copies of Moby Dick in his lifetime? … and in both cases they were later granted “global superstardom” that lasted at least a *century.* But at the time, hardly anybody noticed.

I think that all the stuff about “global superstar” boils down to is — A lot of people think that Adam is mad talented and very charismatic. But being those things doesn’t even guarantee that he would ever have been discovered, let alone guarantee any particular kind of future.

In the old days of both music and sports, rookies were allowed to make mistakes and get their feet wet – in terms of making an album for release, AL is still a rookie, no matter what HiFi says, bwah and even with all the money 19/RCA has to surround him with the best collaborators.

These days rookies are expected to sell like the veterans out of the gate and in sports they are expected to be superstars their first season, the latter because they are being paid outrageous salaries when they haven’t proven themselves yet at a professional level. I would not want that kind of pressure ever. It is hard enough to be a rookie but to be expected to meet such high expectations from the get go -that is incredible pressure piled on top of incredible pressure. Some thrive on it, others choke on it – some that have choked have managed to turn it around and survive, others either never get another chance.

Paris Hilton gets lots of attention – does she have talent?

Octomom gets lots of attention – does she have talent?

There are many whose star shone brightly only to be forgotten just as quickly. Amy Winehouse won the Best New Artist Grammy in 2008. She’s getting lots of attention but not for her talent. Mind you, yes in Amy’s case she is the author of her own falling and she can rise back up if she doesn’t kill herself first and gets some help.

I have never heard about any american idols before and now I know why, most of them are so ordinarily, and their music so borring. It just not that kind of music that is in over here.

As I said Denmark is difficult to reach but Adam did it, he has a lot of fans here already. I think it is because hes not a typical american. We can identify with him and we just love when someone come along that can make some stir in the conservative US and all those intolerant people that live there. I actually belief he has a bigger future in europe then in the US if he make some good music of course. He just is exciting^^

The above quote is kind of funny really. Because if this was the truth donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t you think he might have won the contest, and guess what he lost. So I guess all the American Idols voters who did not vote for him missed the fact that he was a once in a generation discovery

Guess what Elvis lost a singing contest in Memphis before he was discovered and became a once in a generation discovery.

True. I mean, “once-in-a-generation talent” is a pretty extreme label to put on anybody, and there are a lot of great singers and artists who probably don’t qualify for it, and while I do think Adam’s voice alone puts him a pretty elite class (that doesn’t mean you have to love his voice–I love Bob Dylan’s voice, and he isn’t winning any singing awards), I certainly wouldn’t be giving that label to someone before they put out an album. But winning or losing AI definitely doesn’t determine whether or not a person qualifies for that label.

That said, it does seem like this year–perhaps unlike in years past, thought I don’t know for sure–the most talented people on the show have been recognized and rewarded. Adam, Kris, and Allison were definitely a cut above the rest all season, and now they are going to make albums.

The above quote is kind of funny really. Because if this was the truth donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t you think he might have won the contest, and guess what he lost. So I guess all the American Idols voters who did not vote for him missed the fact that he was a once in a generation discovery

Guess what Elvis lost a singing contest in Memphis before he was discovered and became a once in a generation discovery.

The above quote is kind of funny really. Because if this was the truth donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t you think he might have won the contest, and guess what he lost. So I guess all the American Idols voters who did not vote for him missed the fact that he was a once in a generation discovery

The industry and the press obviously think differently than the American Idol voters….I think they had their own vote and guess who won. It’s kind of wierd.

Ifà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦as you said, mj, ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a big ifà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.the contract is real, I actually think there could be repercussions. Big ones.

If Adam had the contract 19E will have to do something to salvage their reputation. It will look really bad if they just allow it. They could drop his 19M representation, cut the amount spent on his album, or even sue.

This really opens them (19E and Fox) up to lawsuits from any contestant or conspiracy theorist who thinks this thing is riggedà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦and there are plenty.

Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s no loss if Adam doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t get to release his album on RCA. They might lose a few bucks on the album, but save themselves a lawsuit. They could also end up saving themselves from a failed album. We canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t predict the future.

If Adam hadn’t been eligible for AI we’d know it by now. The criteria for eligibility is, in practice, being able to sign the contract with 19E that all the semi-finalists sign. 19E just want to have all the rights to the contestants specified in that contract, they don’t care for anything else. If anyone else had a prior claim to Adam that would make that contract invalid, they’d be in court by now. No one has taken Adam/19E to court, so I don’t see any problems.

More specifically, if Hi Fi or Wilshire had any claims to Adam they wouldn’t be just releasing these press releases and a silly demo in iTunes. They’d have lawyers demanding millions in compensation from Adam/19E/RCA for breaking the contract and/or they’d require Adam to honor the contract to make a record for them. Since none of that is happening I find it hard to believe they have any current claim on him or that there’s been any broken contracts. They can’t have a contract with Adam that would make him ineligible for AI if they can’t sue Adam/19E/RCA for breaking that contract.

My question is how did this global superstar not get recognized until American Idol? Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m serious here. Every show he auditioned for, every song he sang should have been pure gold. All those producers should have recognized his off-the-chart talent. Agents, record producers or whomever would be on the look-out for such unprecedented talent, salivating at the mouth. Why didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t Adam get more recognition, more leading roles?

Maybe it was the gay thing.

I’m serious here too.

Stop and think about it. In Adam’s initial audition, what did Simon say? You’re too theatrical. And Randy said something along the lines of, “maybe it’s time for someone like you.” To me, “theatrical” sounded awfully code for “gay.” And even though Adam went into that audition stripped down, with no make-up or feathers, he didn’t fool anyone, did he? (And I don’t think he was really trying to, anyway.)

One of the reasons Adam has been the big story this year is because people have known all along about his sexuality. And the question every week was: how will the Idol viewers react? Will they accept him? Will they embrace him? Will they vote him through to the next round? And every week Adam surprised us, showing us different sides of his musical talent and wowing us with his creativity and showmanship. Along the way he collected a diverse group of fans, some who loved his ROF persona, some who thrilled to the rock voice and others who fell for ballad Adam. And he charmed us too, collectively, with his sweet and respectful personality.

Ultimately the gay thing did deny him the top prize. (In my opinion, a straight Adam would have won the Idol crown hands down.) But no matter. His tenure on AI garnered him a large and loyal fanbase. And he proved that his gayness is not an issue for a large group of people who love him and will support him because of his music and who could care less about the other personal stuff.

So in answer to your questions above, evanjane, those agents and record producers might have noticed Adam’s unprecedented, off-the-chart talent, but because of the enormous dollars involved in taking an unknown face and building him or her into a successful recording artist, they might have been reluctant to take a chance on Adam because he was gay.

When you think about it, while Proposition 8 resulted in us taking two giant steps backward, AI actually took us a half step forward.

I think it goes like this: Why did it take long for Hi-Fi to surface? Perhaps they were waiting to see if Adam would make it big. Hi-Fi would use its ace wisely. Why release it now? Because Adam is a hot commodity right now. Why not wait until his RCA album gets out. Well, Adam may be famous for now, but would the reception be the same post-RCA first album? It’s too early to say. Strike while the iron is hot.

Also, if Hi-Fi is as crappy as people want to believe it to be, then I don’t think it’s in Hi-Fi’s best interest to get entangled in multiple lawsuits, unless, they are quite sure they have an ace up in their sleeves.

IMO, while Hi-Fi might be a shrewd capitalist, they released Melinda’s album.